Last week I noted an op-ed by former Maryland Lieutenant Governor Kathleen Kennedy Townsend that told how her father, Robert F. Kennedy, favored ending all travel restrictions to
A reader commented, with good reason, that this is the same RFK that led Operation Mongoose, a covert action campaign that used sabotage in
It turns out that RFK’s recommendation on travel, contained in this memo (pdf), came in December 1963 during the Johnson Administration, about a year after the operation had been suspended. Kennedy, the U.S. Attorney General, was clearly in a different frame of mind. He believed that ending travel restrictions was “more consistent with our views of a free society” and would head off an “increasingly embarrassing” situation where student groups would travel to
But he also wanted “special regulations” that would require Americans to have the State Department validate their passports for travel to
Fidel Castro liked the article, by the way (Spanish here, English here).
"But {RF Kennedy} also wanted “special regulations” that would require Americans to have the State Department validate their passports for travel to Cuba. That, he said, would allow the U.S. government to block the travel of “suspected saboteurs.”
ReplyDeleteThis must be why all Cubans who want to visit any other country (with the exception of nascent Free Territories such as Venezuela and North Korea) are considered a "suspected saboteur" by the Revolutionary Authorities.
man you people are so paranoid. my 65 year old mother in law has travelled out of cuba five times already, she's certainly a suspected saboteur. must be her cooking.
ReplyDeleteRFK's concern was over the hundreds of terrorist attacks against cuba under kennedy's regime. it is an odd thing based on what they had been doing to cuba, but even that early on there was the realization that normalization was desired more than confrontation. too bad it wasn't followed through.
anonimo
Sobre esto comento en: http://cubabit.blgospot.com
ReplyDeletePhil Peters,
ReplyDeleteThanks for the clarification on the dates! Bobby's change of mind is one more reason why many Cubans would feel justified in their animosity against the Kennedy clan. There was too much blood spilled on both sides to satisfy the intellectual games of the Best and the Brightest, and Cuba was definitely a game just like those wonderful football games in the Kennedy compound during glorious weather days!
Once burnt twice shy I would say to my Cuban friends! Two Kennedys screwed you up in the past. Don't trust the next one!
Having said the Kennedys do cut a wonderful profile! They exude such joy for living. American icons all of them, I say!
Vecino de NF
Anon 9:06 wrote: " man you people are so paranoid. my 65 year old mother in law has travelled out of cuba five times already, she's certainly a suspected saboteur."
ReplyDeleteAnd how many month's income (AKA "Sabateur's Tax") did your mother in law have to pay for the "privelege" of travelling?
In fact, the tax on property for those wishing to obtain a tarjeta blanca to emigrate from the Worker's Paradise is 100 percent. Think about it, if you are capable.
Phil Peters,
ReplyDeleteYou said "same RFK that led Operation Mongoose, a covert action campaign that used sabotage in Cuba and other actions to bring about the overthrow of the Castro government." Are "other actions" euphemisms for assasination attempts? What happened to the old "termination with extreme prejudice"? That one had a nice ring to it specially when the way is was said in Apocalypse Now.
Just having a little fun! Thanks for the info!
Vecino de NF
anon 1148 - i know it's hard but try and focus on one thing; and travel for anyone else outside of cuba is free? travel is a privilege, where do you travel outside your country for free? man you guys are getting desperate.
ReplyDeleteanonimo
vecino -- assassination against fidel and the leadership certainly got the most attention.
ReplyDeleteterrorism against innocent cuban civilians had much great effect. thousands killed from state sponsored terrorism from the US and the gusanos. Manuel Ascune tortured, stabbed, and hung for teaching adults to read and write. just one example
cuban govt has been fighting a war against terrorism for 50 years. and it has had an impact on society. that's the question.
anonimo
Anonimo,
ReplyDeleteHave you heard of My freedom fighter is your terrorist, and vice-versa? The Cuban government was intent on world revolution during that period ("Let's create one, two, many Viet Nams" rings a bell?), and lots of innocent bystanders got killed in that world war. We can focus on the number of victims on both sides and get nowhere, or we can stop pretending and start horse trading. I am inclined toward the second option even though I do know the other side of the score that you choose to ignore.
A couple of questions about the present reality:
1. Did you read about the fact that the State-CUBAINT meetings were going on during the Bush administration as well, and that it appears that the first meeting under Obama was on April 13th last?
2. On a separate tack, have you heard anything about whether the swine flu outbreak was discussed in the Cuban National Defense Council meeting last week? I heard some rumblings that it was part of the agenda, and that one issue brought up was that a quick Cuban response was needed to counter any allegations that the swine flu virus was a chimera virus produced by Cuban biowarfare facilities. (I am not saying that it was, but you know that in this shadow boxing world we inhabit, all kinds of allegations are made, and you must be ready for countermoves just like in chess).
Vecino de NF
vecino -- sorry you are dead wrong. to belittle the thousands of cubans killed by acts of terror and relate it to both sides is as low as it gets. the united states sponsored terrorism against the cuban people. terrorism, not revolution. civilian targets with no military or political value were targeted and innocent people were killed. the only intent was to bring fear to the people and force the govt into increasing security measures. how's that for moral authority
ReplyDeletethe vietnam analogy is interesting, are you saying the american experience in vietnam was nothing but an act of terrorism?
i assume you know the definition of terrorism and the difference between that and revolutionary movements. there is no equivalency and your attempts to muddy the waters is beneath you.
thousands of innocent cubans died at the hands of their fellow citizen terrorists. don't try to conflate terrorism with freedom fighters, that old chestnut doesn't fly here. if you even intimate that then you find justification in 9/11. i hardly think so.
even bush said 'there is no justification for killing innocent civilians. there is no such thing as a good terrorist' and name one act of terrorism that the cuban govt was involved in or supported against american civilian targets.
the cuban govt was intent on world revolution'. that's a hell of a lot of credit for a small island nation. and the communists were two days march from the texas border, remember that fantasy. simple scare tactics to justify the terror brought on by american policies. how sad
even bush continued on monthly basis with cuba-usa talks re gitmo and other matters. my point has always been cuban side willing to negotiate with usa and work towards normalization, for obvious beneficial economic reasons. but US has always wanted to punish and destroy, not talk. there's no other way to read history.
re the bio-terrorism. john bolton tried that BS after the antrax scare and got his ass shot off. cuba has already moved to take precautions with anyone who may be coming in country infected. are you intimating cuba is involved in biowarfare? yet another sick piece of propaganda. the US has biochemical warfare facilities, but cuba gets the false accusations.
and the cuban side does know the affects of swine flu; the one that kills pigs. the one that was intentionally introduced into cuba during the bio-terrorism of the early 1980s. killed half a million pigs, and cubans who can't eat pork are unhappy cubans. (Ok im ready for the 'no way was it bio terrorism' rebuttals. ignore the facts, the proof and the confessions.)
now my question -- any reaction to arlen spector moving over to the lesser of two evils? makes things look even better when the travel restrictions and embargo finally come down through congress. then we can test your delusion, i mean theory, that the cuban govt will collapse as soon as the relations are normalized. i always liked that one.
anonimo
The original 1977 Newsday/SF Chronicle article that confirmed the CIA's and Cuban exile's participation in the devastating Cuban pig virus is reprinted here.
ReplyDeleteAnonimo,
ReplyDeleteI guess that you do not have any responses to my two questions. That's OK.
I have got another one for you. How do you arrive at the figure of thousands of Cubans killed due to US actions? If you have a source, please share it.
The rest of your comments are your opinions and perceptions. I accept their existence although I may not share them.
Leftside,
The problem with the Newsday article is that it is based on hearsay and innuendo. An interesting assesment of the Cuban government allegation of US biowarfare against it was written by Zelikov a few years back. I'll post the reference once I get it.
Vecino de NF
Anonimo,
ReplyDeleteI apologize I missed your answers in the middle of your previous posting. Sometimes I am just obtuse and I don't see the trees from the trees.
Vecino de NF
Apologies to Leftside et alles,
ReplyDeleteThe assesment of alleged biological attacks by the US on Cuba that I referred to was by Zillinkas not Zelikow. (I guessed that I just remembered the first Z). The citation from PubMed is:
Cuban allegations of biological warfare by the United States: assessing the evidence.
Zilinskas RA.
Crit Rev Microbiol. 1999;25(3):173-227. Review. No abstract available.
PMID: 10524329 [PubMed - indexed for MEDLINE
My apologies for being sloppy.
BTW I can not get into your link Leftside but I remembered reading that article many moons ago, and finding it at the time long on allegations and short on scientific data. Having said that I should note that that's the nature of this biowarfare allegations: extremely difficult to prove, very easy to make.
Vecino de NF
Hopefully this link on the CIA-Cuba pig virus will work. They have the eyewitness from the CIA receiving and delivering the virus and they have an eyewitness of the Cuban exile on the boat in Panama receiving the virus. I am not sure what else would be needed in a classified case like this? Are you really suggesting the US did not engage in terrorism of all sorts in Cuba?
ReplyDeleteLeftside,
ReplyDeleteThanks for the link! That's the article I remembered reading. My opinion has not changed because an article that begins "With at least the tacit backing of U.S. Central Intelligence Agency ..." is telling me that there is no direct evidence for the action.
If this happened as alleged, it is a criminal case under US law so I would strongly suggest that it'll be actively pursued in US courts. I know for a fact that the current A.G. would be happy to prosecute this case. So all I am saying if the evidence is there, let's bring it out, and I for one would advocate for the US to indemnify Cuba for the damages caused by this outbreak if it can be proven in a US court that the US government was behind this. Do you think that can be done?
Vecino de NF
Go, Lefty! But you forgot to mention the CIA's invention (in cahoots with those pesky Cuban "exiles" and "dissidents") of the bubonic plague and leperosy, not to mention the heartbreak of psoriasis. What's the matter with you, dude?
ReplyDeleteOr could your flagging fanaticism be the result of the chill pill slipped into your drink by the CIA? Maybe you should check into Hospital Villa Marista for one of Fifo's patented electroshock treatments for dispirited cadres!
anon 451 -- hey Gus. thanks for the laughs. ahh, it'll be so good to listen to your ranting and raving when the walls finally come down. there is overwhelming proof of biwarfare against cuba, but you have to do the homework. now shoo!
ReplyDeleteanonimo
Anonimo,
ReplyDeleteThere is NO proof of biowarfare against Cuba according to Zillinkas. There are lots of allegations by the Cuban government but actual proof is not there. Proving these allegations is next to impossible unless someone comes up and confesses. As far as I know, this has not happened yet. If I am missing something, please point out your sources.
Vecino de NF
vecino -- re the biowarfare against cuba. there is tremendous scientific evidence, backed up by international confirmations from UN etc, that many bio agents have been introduced intentionally into Cuba, swine flu, tobacco rust just a few. Dengue 2 was introduced, caused over 300,000 cases in six months, and appeared in a pattern impossible for natural occurrence.
ReplyDeletemore than 100 children died from it, but maybe that's just part of your tally of both sides.
but you're right, it's hard to prove to 100 percent and apologists can always deny what is overwhelming scientific fact. but then people still don't believe in global warming.
it's very hard to get direct evidence, that's the nature of covert operations of this depth.
i mean, it's not like you can have someone actually confess to the crime. Oh wait. there is. Eduardo Arocena, of the terrorist group Omega 7. He confessed in 1984 that he had visited Cuba in 1980 in connection with a mission to introduce “some germs” into the country, as reported by the New York Times. Arocena’s testimony came during his trial in New York for his connection with the assassination of Cuban diplomat Felix Garcia in front of the United Nations building and with other bombings in the United States against Cuban interests.
At his trial he testified, “The mission of the group was to obtain certain germs to introduce them to Cuba to start the chemical war in Cuba.” One of those was Dengue 2. this was in US court, so you can't blame the cubans for torturing him to get a confession (I mean who would torture anyone these days. oops, nevermind)(See Covert Operation, Jane Franklin Z Magazine June 2003).
and dengue 2 was part of what he did. see Covert Action summer 1982 issue.
And the Fish is Red. and The War that Never Was. and lots more resource info. of course you can pull out the old, 'well there's no direct evidence" and these sources are biased. but at least try and keep an open mind
Any rational thinking person would look at this evidence and come to the conclusion --
“Si camina como un perro, ladra como un perro, y tiene rabo de perro…es un perro’
Cuba was the first country to react to the swine flu, shutting down tourism from mexico for 48 hours. they know how devastating these types of disease can be. they've had first hand experience with it.
and having charges laid in regards to the bio war against cuba.
you're kidding right? This from a country that pardoned terrorist Bosch, does nothing about terrorist Posada, you expect something different? don't think so.
and one final point -- no one should equate internal policies (as odious as you may think they may be) with international terrorism. especially state sponsored terrorism that the US has been involved with against Cuba.
my figures on number of terrorist acts, deaths and injuries comes from one hell of a lot of research.
it's all verifiable, the victims do not lie. believe what you want.
hope this sheds a little more light on this unknown war of terrorism against cuba.
anonimo
Anonimo,
ReplyDeleteI list my sources for anyone to evaluate directly. Can you please list your sources? They help in keeping an open mind.
BTW is Arrocena still in jail? By your dates he was convicted during the Reagan presidency, right? Omega 7 was thoroughly prosecuted by the US government in the 1970s and in the 1980s, right?
Vecino de NF
my sources were noted -- the book The Fish is Red; the book the War that Never Was; Z magazine article date noted, Covert Action summer 1992 issue; just google them and they are there
ReplyDeletethe NY times article re Arocen's confession I"ll have to find, but again its an easy google.
what other sources?
and the article you site re Zilinskas on cuban allegations -- he admitted there is good evidence that weaponized toxins were introduced into Cuba by the US.
he covers the possibility of natural occuring, but he uses the same analysis for each case. really, i took it as a scientist who always hedges his bets saying there is evidence that bio warefare was conducted by US against Cuba. interesting you saw it the other way.
hope you'll reply to the full post
anonimo
Anonimo,
ReplyDeleteYou mention two books: The Fish is Red, and The War that never Was. The first got a really bad review in the NY Times (see http://www.nytimes.com/1981/09/24/books/books-of-the-times-024745.html?scp=3&sq=the%20fish%20is%20red&st=cse), and the second is a novel. Are these your sources?
Vecino de NF
Anonimo,
ReplyDeleteI read Zillinkas paper back when it came out. I recalled he dismissed the biowarfare angle on the dengue epidemics. There is a difference between toxins and biological agents (germs, fungi, virus, bacteria, etc). All the cases you mention are biological agents not toxins per se.
Your critiscism of Zillinkas approach/style is troubling because if you choose to dismiss the scientific approach, there is very little we can discuss. If you do not have verifiable evidence, all you have is an opinion. Opinions are nice, but if you want to live in the real world as you admonished us continously we should work with evidence.
The Arocena's article is interesting but inconclusive because there has never been any follow-up. BTW you did not answer my two questions I posed about Arocena and Omega 7.
Vecino de NF
i give up, believe what you want, if arocena's sworn testimony isn't good enough then nothing is. please explain what follow up do you mean?? his brother confirming this? the photos of him dropping the mosquitos out of the plane? the cubans did 300,000 cases of follow up and buried more than 100 children. and they still spray every year for dengue 2.
ReplyDeleteis someone's sworn testimony inconclusive when combined with the fact cuba experienced the bioterrorism at the time? two plus two equals four in my world
i didn't ask you for your opinion of an NY Times review, i gave you the books and articles. the Fish is Red is often criticized by the ruling elite who just cant accept the terrible things the US has done to others. i'm sure you won't read it now that the NY Times has given it a bad review. wow.
The war that never was; an insiders account of CIA covert ops against Cuba. by Bradley Earl Ayers. it his non-fiction account of training terrorists and their attacks against cuba.
go check out the article is you think the books are unworthy. but that wont matter, you'll just come back with some excuse to discount them.
i simply pointed out that Zilinkas himself admitted there was evidence there was bioterrorism against Cuba. do you refute that, or will you just ignore it? his expertise on dengue 2 is secondary; look to those on the ground dealing with daily for the more credible scientific evidence. and then look at the history of US involvment in bioterrorism, specifically dengue 2. then took at the confession of the person. but that's ok, 100 scientists saying one thing doesn't carry the weight of one saying the other.
the point is go beyond just the scientific, look at the other aspects, the fact dengue 2 was unheard of in cuba then 300,000 cases of it in six months, a man confesses, proof of US intention. what else do you want?
re omega 7 and arocena, don't know if he's still in jail, hope he is. what did the US do against omega 7? again, what's your point? is omega 7 still in operation in miami, lets find out. or not, could care less.
anonimo
vecino -- do you or do you not believe there has been a terrorist war against cuba since the earliest days of the revolution.
ReplyDeletewhat is your opinion of the cubana airlines, bombing, the hotel bombings, the attack on boca de sama; the murders of student teachers, etc etc.
if not then there really is nothing further to discuss.
and again, this all gets back to the question that never gets answered.
anonimo
Re the recommendation that Lefty undergo electroshock "treatment" in Villa Marista as part of Castro's patented incentive program for dispirited cadres, Lage and Perro Roque have just issued written statements enthusiastically endorsing the invigorating results of this "treatment." And by a remarkable coincidence, the wording of their written statements are almost identical, just like their "resignation" statements! Another Revolutinary miracle, eh Lefty? Will the miracles never cease?
ReplyDeleteAnonimo,
ReplyDeleteThere was an insurgency in Cuba during the period 1959-1973 against a government that was ruling by decree with no constitutional basis. This insurgency at times used what we now all agree to call terrorist methods but many of those actions were the same actions that were employed by previous Cuban insurgencies whether in the XIX century or during the uprising against Fulgencio Batista's rule. (Maybe you are too young to remember the night of the 100 bombs planted by the 26th of July movement in Havana, the kidnapping of the driver Fangio, the hijacking of the plane that eventually crashed into the sea while bringing personnel and supplies to the M-26 movement in Oriente, and the various extrajudicial executions of presumed informers by Fidel Castro's forces in the Sierra Maestra). Other tactics were updated versions of past tactics using more current technology. The Cuban government responded by supporting anti-US movements both in the US and around the world. All of these have been admitted by the principals. Because both sides have used similar tactics, I refuse to get into arguments about which side was justified. I am interested in normalizing relations. If you are just interested in getting "justice" for past actions, there is truly nothing to discuss.
That the insurgency against the uncostitutional Cuban government was aided by the US is not contended but what is contended is whether US supported insurgency in Cuba after 1962. All the US documents make it clear that Operation Mongoose was dismantled after the Cuban Missile Crisis. Many of the people were recycled in the same way that many of the FMLN, Sandinista, and other guerillas have been recycled into civilan society whether in their home countries or abroad. This is the way that the world works.
All insurgency movements against the Cuban government from US soil after 1962 have been strongly prosecuted by the US government regardless of which political party is in power. This is also well documented in court proceedings and the press.
You keep referring to a question that never gets answered. Could you for once state the question by itself in a post rather than burying into a long post? For the life of me I have no idea what is your QUESTION!
Vecino de NF
Anonimo,
ReplyDeleteI stand corrected on the issue of The War that never was. I was referring to a novel by Palmer. I was not aware of the book by Ayers (Bradley not Bill).
By the way on the follow-up on the Arocena's testimony, I was referring to criminal follow-up not corroborating evidence. Having said that do you have a picture of Arocena releasing the mosquitoes? BTW did he refere to mosquitoes on his testimony?
Vecino de NF
when has america ever prosecuted terrorists from miami to the extent they should be. why are bosch and posada still walking around free even though the american govt has recognized their terrorist activities. the facts remain unchallenged re dengue 2 and the bioterror war. do with them what you want. because the US didn't follow up on a criminal action means to you that Arocena's testimony is discounted?? you honestly expect the US to do anything about terrorists that they have supported and actions they have condoned?
ReplyDeleteposada's trouble is that he may have lied about the hotel bombings, a far cry from moving on the evidence that he was the mastermind.
Alpha 66 still brags on their website re the hotel attacks and the action against Boca de Sama. and the US has done what?
your position is simply untenable and makes finding common ground near impossible.
CIA involvement in the swine flu epidemic in cuba has been extensively reported and documents are available. The US govt is implicit in terrorist activities against Cuba long after Operation Mongoose, either directly or by not intervening, (re Cubana Airlines)
there is is a difference between a national insurgency and state sponsored terrorism. when the cuban-americans launched terrorist attacks against another country (exiles or not) with the assistance and acknowledgement of the US government that's state sponsored terrorism.
you are 100 per cent correct, there was bombings and 'terrorist' activities during batista's regime, and before, from opponents trying to overthrow the dictatorship. these were cuban actions in cuba against a despised govt. history has many, many examples of internal actions that could be called terrorism, US history included.
here's the difference -- when these acts are conducted by organizations outside cuba, with the support and aid of a foreign power, then that's terrorism.
internal insurgency has no equivalency to terrorist attacks perpetrated by organizations outside the country with the support of a foreign power.
the united states has long known the activities of terrorist organizations in south florida, from the 60s to the 90s and done nothing, or very little. that's terrorism.
when you can prove the cuban government has conducted terrorist attacks against american civilians, then we can talk of equivalency. how has the cuban govt used the same tactics against the United States as you say in your post? please cite proof.
you say Cuba involved in foreign actions, granted, but the US as well. please name one govt cuba has overthrown as US did in Iran, Guatemala, Chile, etc etc.
you keep referring to constitutional govt as the litmus test of legitimacy. the support of the people confers legitimacy. cuba has a constitution now. and there was very little legitimacy under the 1940 constitution.
anonimo
Give 'em hell, Anon 1:13. And what about the damage inflicted on innocent Cubans by watching all those subversive satellite TV connections? Not to mention the book-bombs spread throughout the island by those independent librarian terrorists.
ReplyDeleteindependent librarian terrorists, good one Gus. you mean the ones that were supplied and financed by the american terrorist state under jefe gusano carson. and i love those novellas and other soap operas from radio martibs i watch on the dish
ReplyDeletenot gus
Anonimo,
ReplyDeleteWe agree there is no possible common ground if you find my opinions untenable. To find common ground one must first agree to the right of the other person to have an opinion that disagrees with one's own. By definition one's positions are always tenable by the person who has it.
As far as the Cuban government conducting terrorist attacks against American civilians, I am sure that you know that there was ample support of US revolutionary movements during the 1960s and 1970s to groups such as the Macheteros from Puerto Rico, the Weathermen Underground, and the Black Panther Pary all of which advocated for the violent overthrow of the US government. All three of these conducted terrorist and criminal acts on US soil. Some of their members are still enjoying political asylum in Cuba.
I am still waiting for the single sentence QUESTION that you are so happy to ask me to answer.
Vecino de NF
vecino -- so Cubans went into the united states and committed terrorist acts against American civilians, is that what you are trying to say re your comments on weathermen etc.
ReplyDeleteif you have any proof that a cuban national or group with the support of the cuban government went into the united states and committed an act of terrorism against american civilians, i would be greatly interested to know. if you can provide details etc i really seriously would reconsider my entire position. and how did the cubans support these organizations? were there members of these groups training in cuba, receiving funds in cuba. bein in support is a meaningless term, the US has supported the worst right ring dictatorships in latin american, direct support. Again you use terms that are open to so much interpretations, please be specific.
your post directly links cuban govt involvement in terrorist attacks against american civilians by what you claim to be support for certain revolutionary movements. that's a very, very serious accusation and you better have some proof, some links (like you asked me to provide) to back up that statement. if not you are now involved in spurious accusations on the level of bolton's claim re cuban bioterrorism. or worse. if you can provide proof or links i'll be the first to apologize. but i'd like a direct answer to this. a direct action that killed american civilians that the cubans or cuban govt was responsible for. you made the accusation, now back it up.
was there a cuban operation mongoose? maybe i'm missing some history there.
or please let me know when anti-american cuban groups attacked towns in the US, like Alpha 66 did against boca de sama.
you're entitled to your opinion, as i am. but im trying to establish some basis for common ground, (usa supported terrorism against cuba, the facts are irrefutable, and you either ignore or try and misdirect into some topic that has no connection)
i notice no other comment to my post, assume you agree.
anonimo
Anonimo,
ReplyDeleteNever assume, it makes an ass of u(you) and me! But if you have to assume, err on the side of sanity and assume that I do not agree with you!
What is the QUESTION? (To help obtuse people like me, feel free to number your questions, and keep them simple and to the point!)
Vecino de NF
yeah that assume joke my grandfather told me. but i take your point.
ReplyDeletethe guestion can wait, i've asked it a number of times with no response. so till another time.
anxiously though for your serious reply to my previous post re terrorism and your implication that cuban govt has been involved in terrorist acts against american civilian targets. based on your post.
anonimo
Anonimo,
ReplyDeleteIt sounds like your grandfather is/was a wise man. Follow his advice!
I have nothing to add to my previous post. I stand by my statements but I don't have the time right now to produce a bibliography to support them. I am sure that if you put your mind to it, you can throroughly document my statements. There is no need to belitle my limitations; a simple I disagree with your opinion suffices.
BTW I have moved to the next posting.
Vecino de NF
here's another thing my grandfather said -- it's better to keep your mouth shut and thought a fool than to open it and remove all doubt.
ReplyDeleteim not belitting your limitations; this is simply a tactic of yours to misdirect the matter at hand.
YOU made this very serious accusation, not me. you made the accusation then beg off trying to support it or even attempt to clarify it. when i made my post re terrorism i backed it up.
this isn't a difference of opinion, you accused the cuban govt of being involved in terrorist activities against american civilians. so, now back it up like you demand of others.
but no, you admit you have no proof to substantiate it, then you try to misdirect to something else, or put the onus on me to find out.
i have found out, and i can not document your statement that the cuban government was involved in terrorist acts against american civilians because it is not true. it is a lie. it is the worst type of propaganda, something that the cuban govt has had to put up with for 50 years and thats why everyone is so tired of the same old BS. and thank god more and more are finally realizing who is telling the truth and who is not.
what a terrible thing to do to make an accusation like you did, and then run away.
if you want to refute my charge then go right ahead, but unless you can back up YOUR statements i suggest you follow my grandfather's advice.
I must in all honesty tell you i wasn't surprised that you couldn't, or wouldn't answer me directly.
now you can go ahead and get all indignant, but isn't it about time you took responsibility for your posts?
i await any response to your claim, any clarification, proof, or a withdrawal.
anonimo
Anonimo,
ReplyDeleteDo you get paid for posting or don't you have anything better to do? I already took responsibility for my posts but I do not have the time right now to give you extensive backup for my opinions. I am not going to get indignant, and I expect much to your chagrin I will not stop my comments. BTW this is not about you and me, it's about commenting on the relations between two countries/people/governments.
As kids like to say, chill out dude! Take a pill!
Vecino de NF
ouch!! wow that was stinging. like the kids say, gee gramps that was a good one. ROFLMGO!! (psst, its 2009 dude, not 1985)
ReplyDeleteyou are a piece of work -- the last fricking thing you did was take responsibility for your post, that's the whole point. so whatever outrageous accusation you think of you can make with no accountability.
it aint about relations between cuba and usa; its about you pulling whatever you want out of your culo and then getting indignant when someone calls you on it.
best of luck vecino, i know hard hard it must be for your side.
anonimo
Anonimo,
ReplyDeleteIf it came out my you-know-what, you sure ate it up with gusto! Indignant, heck no! This is fun. This is like those old Westerns that you wait for the right comment to be made at the bar so the punches and the chairs start flying!
Thanks for the calendar update! Taken your pill yet?
Vecino de NF
yeah the blue one. what colors yours. mines oral, assume yours a suppository.
ReplyDeleteso now you're saying it was all a joke. my what a high level of discourse this has come to
thank god my book tour is starting soon.
anonimo
Anonimo,
ReplyDeleteWhat's the title of your book? I would love to read it.
Vecino de NF
Probably something in the vein of Abbie Hoffman's quote about Castro being "A mighty penis coming to life"...
ReplyDeletechingon